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Where Taxpayers and Advisers Meet

Making Tax Digital

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm
Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Sat Dec 13, 2025 8:16 am

And the FW in charge of the FW who pressed the MTD4IT proceed button then promoted him. What a FW of all FW decision that was.

As a junior I worked with a sub-manager whose favourite phrase was 'life isn't fair'. Never been so appropriate with all these FWs in charge. And where are the regulators who are supposed to regulate the FWs?

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Sat Dec 13, 2025 8:32 am

FWs seem to be ignoring this recommendation which was previously accepted...why are they ignoring it now....because they are FWs?:


The Committee's Position: The House of Lords Finance Bill Sub-Committee urged the government to delay the MTD implementation and conduct a full, year-long pilot program (covering a full 12-month tax year cycle) to properly test the software and systems before making them mandatory for all businesses.

Reasoning: The peers (members of the House of Lords) found that the proposed pilot program at the time did not allow sufficient time to cover a full annual business cycle and was therefore inadequate for identifying all potential issues. They argued that the government's timetable was too ambitious and posed a significant risk to small businesses.

Outcome: The Chancellor of the Exchequer subsequently announced a 12-month delay to the implementation of MTD for unincorporated businesses with turnovers under the VAT threshold, partially acknowledging the concerns raised by the committee and other professional bodies. MTD for Self Assessment has faced multiple delays since, ultimately being phased in from 2026 and 2027.

This quote is a common reference point in UK tax commentary regarding the need for adequate testing and consultation periods before major HMRC system changes are implemented.

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Mon Dec 15, 2025 8:48 am

Labour MPs are you ready?

Yes, HMRC’s decision to proceed with Making Tax Digital (MTD) for Income Tax without full testing could have significant risks, both for the tax system and for taxpayers. Lord Carter’s recommendation to conduct thorough testing was rooted in the need for robust piloting to ensure that the system functions correctly for all stakeholders. If HMRC moves forward without addressing these concerns, several potential risks could arise:

1. Technical Failures and System Instability

Incomplete or Inadequate Testing: If the system hasn’t been thoroughly tested, there’s a chance it could experience glitches, downtime, or data-processing errors. Small businesses, self-employed individuals, and landlords may face difficulties in meeting their obligations, which could lead to penalties or miscalculations of taxes owed.

Increased Complexity: For many taxpayers, digital reporting could initially be confusing or intimidating. If MTD is rolled out without proper refinement, it might lead to widespread errors or inefficiencies in filing and reporting, which would further burden the system.

2. Increased Compliance Burden

Small Business Impact: Self-employed individuals and small businesses might struggle with the increased burden of regular digital reporting. Many of these businesses may not have the necessary digital infrastructure, experience, or capacity to transition to MTD smoothly. This could increase costs, administrative workload, and the risk of non-compliance.

Financial Penalties: Without full testing, there’s a risk of more people being penalized for technical errors, such as incorrect data submissions, late filings, or system failures. This could create frustration and resentment, especially for smaller entities that may lack the resources to navigate the new system.

3. Data Privacy and Security Risks

Vulnerabilities in the System: If the system isn't fully tested, it could be more vulnerable to cyberattacks, data breaches, or other security issues. Sensitive taxpayer information, including financial data, could be at risk, leading to legal, reputational, and financial repercussions for both HMRC and the taxpayers involved.

Unauthorized Data Sharing: As digital systems often involve multiple layers of software integration, there’s a risk that sensitive data could be shared inappropriately, whether through errors or deliberate actions. The public's trust in the system could suffer if they feel their personal data is not adequately protected.

4. Inequity and Digital Exclusion

Unequal Access to Digital Tools: Not all taxpayers have equal access to technology or the necessary digital skills. Those in rural areas, older populations, or from lower-income backgrounds might struggle more than others, exacerbating existing inequalities. If MTD doesn’t adequately account for this, it could create an unfair burden on certain groups.

Workaround Measures: If certain taxpayers or groups can’t comply, there could be a reliance on paper-based systems or manual reporting, which could undermine the benefits of the digital system. This could create inefficiencies and inconsistencies in the tax system.

5. Economic Disruptions

Business Disruptions: MTD could be disruptive for businesses, particularly during the transition phase. If businesses face challenges with the new system, it could cause delays in invoicing, accounting, and cash flow management. For some, this could lead to financial strain or even failure, particularly in industries that rely on tight financial management.

Lack of Early-Stage Feedback: Without testing, HMRC may not fully understand how the system impacts various sectors or whether it aligns with the needs of taxpayers. As a result, adjustments may need to be made on the fly, which could lead to further disruptions and confusion.

6. Political and Public Backlash

Trust in HMRC: If taxpayers perceive that the system has not been sufficiently tested and implemented in a rushed or poorly managed way, it could undermine trust in HMRC. If errors lead to higher levels of enforcement or penalties, the agency might face widespread public dissatisfaction.

Political Fallout: Politicians could be quick to criticize HMRC for failing to manage the rollout effectively, especially if it affects a large number of constituents. Given that tax reforms like this often have political ramifications, any failure could become a point of political contention.

7. Missed Opportunities for Effective Data Integration

Lack of Fine-Tuning: A major benefit of MTD is its potential to improve the way HMRC interacts with taxpayers and the data it collects. By testing the system thoroughly, HMRC could identify ways to integrate more efficient data analysis tools, streamline communication with taxpayers, and enhance reporting accuracy. Rushing the system could mean missing these opportunities.

Lower Adoption of Digital Tools: If the system faces significant issues early on, it could hinder adoption by businesses and individuals. People might be reluctant to adopt digital systems for tax reporting if they encounter repeated issues, or if they feel the system is not user-friendly.

8. Long-Term Sustainability Issues

Maintenance and Upgrades: A lack of proper testing can result in an unstable foundation, leading to long-term difficulties in maintaining the system. Future upgrades or changes could become more difficult if issues have not been identified and resolved at an early stage.

Cost Implications: If the rollout is problematic, HMRC may need to allocate additional resources to address issues that could have been prevented with more testing. This could lead to unnecessary government spending, and potentially a shift in focus from long-term improvements to short-term fixes.

Conclusion: A Risky Path Forward

HMRC moving ahead with MTD for Income Tax without full testing, contrary to Lord Carter's recommendation, introduces a variety of risks. These include technical failures, increased administrative burdens, security vulnerabilities, and negative economic and political consequences. To mitigate these risks, a more gradual, well-tested implementation approach would be prudent, allowing for better integration and addressing issues before they impact taxpayers at a larger scale.

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Tue Dec 16, 2025 10:45 am

Yes, HMRC’s decision to proceed with Making Tax Digital (MTD) for Income Tax without full testing could have significant risks, both for the tax system and for taxpayers.

A significant risk means a potential negative event that is large enough to be important, likely to cause serious harm, major disruption, or a material financial misstatement, requiring focused attention and specific management, unlike minor inconveniences or trivial issues. It's a combination of potential severity (how bad it could be) and probability (how likely it is to happen), demanding serious consideration in areas like health & safety, finance, or auditing.

Presumably MP Murray's 'thorough interrogation' of HMRC highlighted the eight potentials risk areas that could occur by rushing through the introduction of MTD4IT.

-Did he act recklessly in proceeding without robust testing?
-If so, should he have received a promotion for acting in a reckless manner?
-Will anyone investigate and if he did act recklessly will any action be taken?

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Fri Dec 19, 2025 7:23 am

-AI thinks it is very risky.
-Accountingweb readers think it is crazy.
-I can't help feeling we would be better off sacking all MPs and going with the above. Have you noticed as the calibre of MPs decreases more are awarded gongs?

By FactChecker
18th Dec 2025 22:18
I'd hate to lose my reputation (apparently) for being a cynic to my core, but my conclusion on reading the culmination of those 4 individuals' thoughts, claims and suggestions?

... that's possibly the longest 'begging letter' I've read for many a year.

* Sorry but there won't be an announcement in 2028/29 that those below £20k will come into MTD; nor an announcement saying taxpayers will no longer be able to file their tax returns through the HMRC online services.
[not unless the Treasury has by then decided that tax-free allowances have risen above £20k - and, if they want to avoid Poll Tax style reactions, not even then]

* It's not worth commenting on 'the benefits' - everyone else can see the King's new clothes

* “Breaking it down into four quarters doesn’t really create extra work; it just spreads it across the year” ... would the speaker like to explain how that works for him? I can think of nothing (in medicine or manufacturing or social care or anything else that he cares to put forward) where starting & stopping a process 3 times pa doesn't ADD to the effort, complexity and likelihood of errors.

I could keep dissecting, although that won't change their minds, but I particularly liked the (unintentional?) honesty of Chris' ...
"Downing also stressed the value of testing, particularly while HMRC support remains effective"
[so the effectiveness, however that's measured, of HMRC support has a short shelf-life and should be consumed before it 'goes off'?]


By FactChecker
18th Dec 2025 22:04
"MTD myths: What’s true, what’s not and what’s next"

Aside of the missing question-mark ... the answers are simple:
* what's true? = most of what's been written on this site (by members not by spokespeople)
* what's not? = the inverse sources (particularly 'positive spin' pronouncements from HMRC)
* what's next? = haven't got a clue (not my assessment, but various HMRC non-spokespeople)



Replying to FactChecker:

By FactChecker
18th Dec 2025 22:09
Or an alternative set of answers:
* what's true? = that it will cost taxpayers (but rather more than official 'forecasts')
* what's not? = that benefits to taxpayers will be unbelievable (actually that *is* true!)
* what's next? = the most drawn-out death of a tax system (so at least that's 'world beating')


Merry Christmas all!

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Sat Dec 20, 2025 8:14 pm

MTD4IT-This parrot is no more! It has ceased to be!

Unravelling quicker than West Ham's defence at City today. The accountingweb crowd are chanting 'you don't know what you are doing/sacked in the morning, you're getting sacked in the morning'.

Will Labour's policy team head this off before the contagion spreads further?

https://www.accountingweb.co.uk/tax/hmrc-policy/mtd-myths-whats-true-whats-not-and-whats-next

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Sat Dec 20, 2025 8:39 pm

Farmers have secured a one-year reprieve from Making Tax Digital after the NFU warned the system wasn’t properly tested for agriculture

READ MORE: https://www.farminguk.com/.../farmers-win-one-year...

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Sun Dec 21, 2025 5:26 am

A google search came up with a MTD overspend based on 2023 figures. Why are there no more current (now nearly 2026) cost overspend projections available?

The UK government's "Making Tax Digital" (MTD) program is estimated to be overspent by approximately £1 billion compared to its initial forecast.

The National Audit Office (NAO) and Public Accounts Committee (PAC) reports from mid-2023 highlighted the following details about the overspend and delays:
Original Estimate: In 2016, the estimated cost for introducing MTD for all three taxes (VAT, Income Tax, and Corporation Tax) was £226 million.

Current Forecast: The forecasted cost for MTD for Income Tax (ITSA) and VAT alone has surged to £1.3 billion, a 400% increase in real terms for those components.

Overspend Amount: The overspend on the program is around £1 billion more than the original comprehensive estimate.

Taxpayer Costs: HMRC's cost-benefit analyses reportedly omitted an estimated £1.5 billion in upfront transitional costs that would be incurred by taxpayers, such as purchasing new software or getting agent support.

Delays: The rollout of MTD for Income Tax Self Assessment (ITSA) has been delayed four times and is now eight years behind the original schedule.
HMRC has stated that the additional tax revenue expected from MTD has increased to £3.9 billion by 2033-34, which it claims will offset any additional costs and provide a positive return on investment in the long run. The Public Accounts Committee has, however, expressed concerns that HMRC has "lost sight of the need to put customers at the heart" of the changes.

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Mon Dec 22, 2025 9:02 am

A good dose of Northen common sense to start the week...how much of our money are they wasting on a system they are struggling to make work....with a system that does work already in place. Difficult to dream up this script. How many hospital operations would the MTD4IT kitty have paid for?...= Tory/Labour cluster**** of all cluster****s.

By North East Accountant
19th Dec 2025 10:54
What is clear about MTD is that we'll go through a whole load of pain, and never ending quarterly hassle..........to arrive at exactly the same tax figure as now.

etf
Posts:1671
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Wed Dec 24, 2025 7:14 am

Has anyone got a spare tractor?

I suspect one tax U-turn may make a second less likely, but perhaps the predicted MTD4IT chaos after April will be just as harmful for Starmer if he is still in post.

I spoke with someone yesterday who had been told there is a nearly a 3 year wait for a cataract operation. It shows the huge amounts of money wasted by Government (viz on MTD4IT) could be put to better use.

Hopefully someone will ask MP Murray in 2026 how successful his 'thorough interrogation' of HMRC on MTD4IT has been.


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