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Where Taxpayers and Advisers Meet

Making Tax Digital

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm
Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Mon Sep 05, 2022 1:33 pm

Yikes....another one!


By Tornado
05th Sep 2022 10:49
Question to HMRC -

"Bearing in mind that the MTD project is unlikely to achieve most of its original aims, what exactly is the point of the project now?"

HMRC Reply -

"Dunno"

Question to HMRC -

"We already have an excellent Tax Administration System called Self-Assessment which is still going to continue indefinitely. What is the point of MTD if Self-Assessment can already handle everything very well as it is?"

HMRC Reply -

"Dunno"

Question to HMRC -

"MTD was justified as the End of The Tax Return. Clearly the Tax Return is going to continue indefinitely so the MTD project has failed already. What is the point of continuing with it?"

HMRC Reply -

"Dunno"

Question to HMRC -

"What day is it today?"

HMRC Reply -

"Dunno"

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Thanks (10)

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Thu Sep 08, 2022 9:15 am

Day 2 and as yet no Prime Mininister MTD4IT intervention. Perhaps she needs a training day with the Chelsea owners.

By GHarr497688
07th Sep 2022 16:51
42 years in Accountancy and reading this rubbish. Makes me sick to my stomach. Lets face it now this isn't going to work is it. HMRC state:

"HMRC’s ambition is to become one of the most digitally advanced tax administrations in the world. Making Tax Digital is making fundamental changes to the way the tax system works – transforming tax administration so that it is:

more effective
more efficient
easier for taxpayers to get their tax right"

How can putting your records into a computer alone be more effective, more efficient and easier to get their tax right.

Computers in the hands of taxpayers who don't understand technology or accounting principals will lead to inaccurate accounts and tax computations that will be such garbage no one will understand them - putting things right will take longer and cost more . Serious risks to lender and the public purse will be the result as profits stated will be wrong and tax payment on those incorrect profits inaccurate.

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Mon Sep 12, 2022 7:54 am

CIOT president calls for MTD ITSA delay
by Rebecca Cave
The Chartered Institute of Taxation president says the current timetable for the Making Tax Digital programme is unrealistic. In attempting to digitise without first undertaking a full review, Rebecca Cave feels the programme has put the cart before the horse.


12th Sep 2022

Compared to most other components of HMRC the self assessment tax return is an Aston Martin level cart. Jim Harra has so many other more pressing issues to deal with within his organisation, viz answering telephones and post, it is pure madness to devote money, time and resources to a Trotter Enterprises three wheeler replacement that will tip over as soon as Shergar starts to pull it.

PS where were the prossional bodies/the not so nimble nine when 30/60 day CGT reporting was introduced? Presumably Rebecca Cave's analysis and posts like that below have sparked then into action.

2)
The Professional associations have not been prepared to act as "Trade Unions" for practitioners
They have been more concerned with maintaining "Relationships" with HMRC. When in reality HMRC regards them as pet poodles. I can point to exact places within their manuals which confirm this point

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Tue Sep 13, 2022 7:05 am

Jim Harra-a man with a track record of introducing crap tax reporting systems.
The not so nimble nine-a track record of letting through untested reporting systems not fit for public use.

Start listening and answer real questions like the one below. You are wasting millions of pounds of public money.

Professional Bodies: Rebecca Cave is currently running rings around HMRC.Please follow her lead.



By Paul Crowley
12th Sep 2022 14:50
Standard question
What is the benefit to the tiny taxpayer of MTD?
If his records are adequate such that the tax is correct then there is zero benefit to either the taxpayer or HMRC. both are wasting resources.
What is the point of cash based three line quarterly returns that HMRC claim will not be used or read, but must be electronically corrected is an error is discovered, for a person that does not even pay any tax at all?
HMRC are unable to give answers to just about every technical question asked and refuse to reply on the supposed benefits
The non taxpayer does not even get effective tax relief on all his new costs
You are defending a Leviathan that has no purpose for traders below the VAT registration limit.
The only certainty is that VAT payments will increase substantially because so many non registered people will be paying for pointless software and needless extra bookkeeping

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Tue Sep 13, 2022 12:45 pm

If Jim Harra hasn't already spent and wasted enough public money on MTD4IT his following statement will surely break public coffers:

If you were given a free hand and could make one change to tax law or practice, what would it be?
I think I had better reserve my policy advice for the Chancellor! Actually, I think I might introduce a £100 penalty for every lie told about HMRC in the press or social media – it would certainly be a revenue raiser!


Presumably he feels it equitable (that word again) that HMRC should pay out £100 each time it is shown to have lied to the public. If so, I claim my 3 x £100 for the three copies of the same letter all of which HMRC advised me had not been received (even though the 3rd attempt was sent by registered post and signed for by HMRC staff and the first letter was also found to be in their hands).

And don't even get me started on the subject of:

- NRCGT late filing penalties and how HMRC has treated taxpayers so unfairly. Identical appeal letters achieve opposite results (a change from 3% successful appeals...mind the gap.... to 99% successful appeals doesn't pass the sniff test).
- recorded telephone message evidence that mysteriously goes missing when it clearly shows inappropriate behaviour from HMRC staff = HMRC cover up.

Is it any wonder that tax advisers/the public are self combusting with frustration?

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Wed Sep 14, 2022 10:07 am

By NotAnAccountant2
13th Sep 2022 12:32
jonharris999 wrote:
If you were the management accountant of a SME, would you be serving your Directors better if you gave them a quarterly report 4 weeks after the quarter-end, or an annual report 9 months after it?

Why would my wife's property business - where the tenancy agreement was signed at the start of May - benefit from quarterly reporting in July, October, January, and April? Other than some minor adjustments for a few expenses we already know what the numbers will be.

And how will MTD cope with the fact that she's handed her notice in to her employer a few weeks ago and started self employment work this week. She handed her notice in before she had any work but she's now done her first few hours. HMRC would have about two weeks to get that business setup in MTD had she already been in it due to the property income. And should she really be spending the first few weeks chasing HMRC so she can do some pointless reporting and avoiding penalties rather than finding more hours?

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Fri Sep 16, 2022 1:42 pm

This one made me smile.

By Nebs
13th Sep 2022 15:57
I agree with a delay rather than scrapping the project. It should be delayed until such time as Leyton Orient win the Premier League.


Is the lack of MTD4IT information on Taxationweb perhaps a sign of confidence that if this project does see the light of day, it is years off?

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:05 am

The Taxpayers Charter is laughable because Jim Harra and friends know that even if they break every rule in the book nobody will question their wild west behaviour:


By Ralphgab
20th Sep 2022 09:51
"All of the above manipulation of accounting results will involve additional costs for those unincorporated businesses and partners affected "

Wasn't there a time when HMRC was supposed to minimise compliance costs to businesses? Indeed this is still in HMRC's laughable Charter

"Making things easy

We’ll provide services that are designed around what you need to do, and are accessible, easy and quick to use, minimising the cost to you."

Instead HMRC seem to think that we all go into business just for the pleasure of collecting and administering tax on their behalf.

etf
Posts:1240
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby etf » Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:38 pm

Copied from echo chamber 2

by bd6759 » Tue Sep 20, 2022 1:31 pm

It was bad enough when you were running 1 echo chamber, but 3? Can’t you use twitter for stuff like this?

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etf
Posts:893
Joined:Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:25 pm
Contact: Contact etf
Re: HMRC-is it time to call the Army in?
Postby etf » Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:21 pm

No, sorry, I don't use it.

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on MTD4IT though. As big as Paul Gascoigne in Italia 90 on accountingweb, but not a peep on here.

I can't understand why it is necessary for the majority of landlords as self assessment tax return reporting seems to work quite well. It is the type of scenario you were given on your first management development training day to see whether you could prioritise tasks in the right order. Jim Harra has the place falling around his ears and yet he continues to plough on in a direction that will create off the scale chaos having learnt nothing from the unwanted 30/60 day CGT reporting accolades he has been awarded with.

I think the NRCGT reporting thread demonstrates my original concerns were correct (even though you disagreed), viz HMRC eventually extended the filing deadline helping those working in a rainforest in Borneo.

Time will tell whether I have called these other areas correctly.

bd6759
Posts:4239
Joined:Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:26 pm

Re: Making Tax Digital

Postby bd6759 » Wed Sep 21, 2022 9:42 am

MTD4IT is a clusterfuck that won’t be ready for 2024. If it is at all necessary it should only apply (at least at first) to VAT registered businesses. 6 returns for a £1000 per month rental business is lunacy.

The meaning of reasonable excuse was explored and dissected by Tribunals with the introduction of HICBC and NRCGT. With expanded case law and a wider interpretation it’s not unexpected that there was a change to the appeal dynamics. More appeals were accepted: it’s understandable and is not a conspiracy. Treating people “even-handedly” does not mean they should be treated the same. What is a reasonable excuse for you might not be a reasonable excuse for me.

If you put as much effort into your understanding of tax law as you do to your indignation if it, you might get a better understanding of the issues you are shouting about.


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