Making Tax Digital

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By JustAnotherUser
14th Nov 2023 12:31
Imagine a giraffe tasking a monkey to find new innovative ways for fish to swim then making those ways the law, just because the zookeeper thought he knew best.

-its pointless
-it will be awful
-they likely wont ask the fish what they want
-was it even needed

and here we have HMRC's MTD for Income Tax.

By Tornado
14th Nov 2023 13:32
MTD ITSA tax calculator is cause for concern

That is a bit of an understatement.

The whole MTD project is cause for concern, especially the thousands of millions of pounds that have already been spent on it for no worthwhile return.

However, it is clear that HMRC is absolutely committed to re-platforming on a new enterprise architecture system.

If the current MTD project ever gets into public use, it will already be out of date as AI will run rings around it. Better to try again with a new, more practical idea that is easier to use, quick to implement and is AI Tamper Proof.

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By kevinringer
15th Nov 2023 13:14
MTD ITSA is ill-conceived because it is way too complex to be successfully operated by the average taxpayer and HMRC have overestimated the capability of software, so MTD ITSA will not close the tax gap. Indeed, the VAT gap widened after MTD VAT came into operation. We agents have been warning HMRC about their unrealistic expectations ever since George Osborne announced MTD way back in 2015. HMRC ignored us and ploughed on. HMRC started the MTD ITSA pilot in 2017. After running the pilot for 6 years HMRC had to close it earlier this year. Though HMRC said little publicly, I think that must have wrung alarm bells in HMRC; what if accountants have been right all along? Then Jim Harra admitted MTD ITSA was more complex than HMRC had expected. Oh dear, accountants have been right all along.

The majority of Self Assessment is already reported to HMRC digitally (I have been reporting digitally for 100% of my clients since 1998). Therefore, reporting via MTD ITSA isn’t Making Tax Digital, because it is digital already.

Instead of wasting £1+ billion on converting an existing digital reporting system (SA) to another vastly more complex digital reporting system (MTD ITSA), HMRC should have spent the money on areas which would have actually improved HMRC service eg more staff on the helplines

PS JustAnotherAnswer forgot to mention the zookeeper is an absolute nutjob...'a mad or crazy person'

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MPs warn that MTD has lost sight of taxpayer benefits
by Tom Herbert
Hot on the heels of Making Tax Digital changes announced at the Autumn Statement, a committee of MPs has highlighted concerns about the costs, delays and deliverability of the programme, stating HMRC has lost sight of needing to put taxpayers at the heart of changes to the tax system and risks 'making tax difficult'.

By Tornado
24th Nov 2023 09:28
I am sure it is obvious to all that MTD needs to be scrapped as soon as possible instead of having thousand of millions more of our hard earned pounds thrown at it for no good reason, especially when many people are desperately trying just to survive, and have no appetite or time for jumping through unnecessary HMRC hoops related to a Vanity Project.

HMRC keep coming up with ever increasingly whacky ideas to save this project effectively trying to destroy the excellent systems that we already have related to tax calculation and collection and the uniform presentation of Accounts and Financial information that we already use on a regular basis.

This is looking more like a total destruction of our traditional values and standards and leads me to seriously wonder if the decision makers at HMRC really are living in the same world as we are, or perhaps, playing away with the Fairies.

It will make no difference as to how many hard wishes they make or group hugs they have, MTD is a monster that has to be slain, and as soon as possible. Quarterly Reporting and other fantasy ideas simply will not happen.

The MTD project died a long time ago and needs to be buried as soon as possible so that we can carry on with and develop the excellent Self Assessment system which has been tried and tested for decades and has been specifically designed for the job of Tax Administration.

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By cydsmith
08th Dec 2023 10:45
This is just getting beyond a joke. If everyone is a 'customer' then where is the customer service. They are happy enough to charge penalties for any reason they can dream up but their own service is so totally inadequate we should be charging them penalties on the same basis. And expert advisors???? where are they. I've not spoken to one of them since about 1995. HMRC should stop wasting time and billions of taxpayers money on MTD, a system that is badly designed, nobody wants and just plain doesn't work and go back to basics and make sure their core service actually delivers. Once we get there - probably about 2051 - then they can progress to 'digital by default'.

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27 Oct 2023 Repayment pending (tax return filed in January 2023)

No money to correctly staff HMRC, but money from taxpayers available for MPs losing their seats to have their CVs written...the me, me, me culture.

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By GHarr497688
24th Jan 2024 13:18
I read an article about the Horizon scandal recently and it said that Government had hid the true implementation costs , knew the systems were flawed but couldn't lose face and that the reality was manual records were replaced by computer records. The Horizon systems was tested and reports said that worked well and saved money. I don't feel the need to make any other comment on MTD at this stage and you draw your own conclusions. I feel so strongly about how wrong MTD is that my retirement has been enhanced.

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By ireallyshouldknowthisbut
24th Jan 2024 09:52
When will they learn?

You cant possibly release a public beta April 2025 and make it mandatory April 2026.............this is 10 months before the first cycle in January 2027 is complete, let alone all the bugs fixed.

If the public beta is launching April 2025, the earliest you can realistically mandate is going to be April 2028, which gives 15 months for bug fixing from January 2027. Given the size of this project even that is optimistic, you really need a soft launch from April 2028 whilst its being volume tested on real tax payers and not just the keen ones who do the beta. The harder cases can then be cleared up for the next 2-3 years and may, just maybe it can be in place with fines etc for non compliance from April 30 or similar.

This is really basic stuff. Zero credibility here for the latest in a long line of pointless dates and plans for this failed project.

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By Rob Swan
24th Jan 2024 11:01
Learn? HMRC??

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By petestar1969
25th Jan 2024 09:30
Completely agree, but Fujitsu are behind the software aren't they? We all know how much testing they (don't) do.

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By johnjenkins
25th Jan 2024 09:56
Don't forget the Fujitsu IT workers at HMRC are on indefinite strike for more money.

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By petestar1969
25th Jan 2024 10:48
I wasn't aware of that. It just gets better doesn't it?

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By johnjenkins
25th Jan 2024 10:56
Loads more to come.

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By FactChecker
24th Jan 2024 13:21
Back to basics ...

1. In order to "resume testing its Making Tax Digital for income tax self assessment (MTD ITSA) system", HMRC will have to first complete the specification for ALL aspects of the WHOLE 'journey' (horrible word).
This doesn't yet exist - so testing parts of it is akin to testing a new transmission system for cars without specifying the type of vehicle (or braking system or ...)!

2. "A list of software that is currently compatible with MTD ITSA" is therefore ... (a) not guaranteed to be 'compatible' with the unspecified bits, and (b) may not make it to the finish line.
So hitching your client to such software (a requirement since "To sign up, agents or taxpayers need to speak with a software provider taking part in the testing regime") is to put it mildly foolhardy.

3. How does Hume reconcile saying "the tax authority is keen to allow enough time for the system to undergo thorough end-to-end testing (a full 21 months, similar to the current self assessment cycle) before going live" with the schedule outlined above?
Even if the complete 'cycle' was understood/specified/developed and ready for testing (which it isn't), the dates just don't fit!

This has U C K F U P written all over it ... and shows every sign that, far from 'learning lessons', the top brass have simply had the blinkers cosmetically welded onto the faces of their spokespeople.

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And my favourite:

By Open all hours
24th Jan 2024 17:36
1). Ronald Reagan's quote needs a slight update the most terrifying words are now ‘I’m from Fujitsu and I’m here to help’.

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Jaws film music playing in the background:

A committee of MPs has published new data showing that HMRC holds eight active contracts with Fujitsu with a combined value of £1.4bn, all of which were awarded after a High Court verdict that ruled the developer’s software was responsible for misreported losses during the Post Office scandal.