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Where Taxpayers and Advisers Meet

Uk Resident and receiving German pension

simpsonite
Posts: 96
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:58 am

Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby simpsonite » Fri Oct 10, 2014 4:30 pm

Hi all,
My UK resident client is In receipt of two sources of German pension; one of which is the German state pension & the other is from a German private pension.
Both pensions are received gross and are paid direct into his German bank account. He then transfers the funds out of his German bank & into his UK bank.

Is this income liable to tax in the UK??? (worldwide income)
After some research I have also read that he might need to complete a German tax Return & this income is not liable to tax in the Uk?!

So, is it the case that it is only for the German authorities to chase my client for any potential tax due?

thoughts much appreciated

simpsonite

bd6759
Posts: 3095
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:26 pm

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby bd6759 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:03 am

The social security pension is only taxable in Germany. There is no UK tax to pay.

The other pension is taxable in the UK if it is not being taxed in Germany.

See article 17 - http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxtreaties/in-force/germany.pdf

King_Maker
Posts: 6538
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:22 pm

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby King_Maker » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:33 am

Foreign pensions usually qualify for a 10% deduction - so only 90% taxable in UK.

bd6759
Posts: 3095
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:26 pm

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby bd6759 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 11:49 am

Foreign pensions usually qualify for a 10% deduction - so only 90% taxable in UK.
Correct

simpsonite
Posts: 96
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:58 am

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby simpsonite » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:07 pm

Hi,
thanks for the reply bd6759.
yep I have already tried to read said article 17 of www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxtreaties/in-force/germany.pdf and it didn't really make much sense to me so I thought I would post the query on here instead! :lol:

Ok, just to recap - So the German state pension is not taxable in the UK under 'Article 17 of the convention between the UK & Germany' for the avoidance of double taxation etc etc...

With regard to the German private pension -
My client receives this gross so this will be taxable in the UK.
King Maker suggests and you concur that 90% of this only is taxable here?

Is there any clear Revenue guidance to back this up?

thanks

simpsonite

King_Maker
Posts: 6538
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:22 pm

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby King_Maker » Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:21 am


bd6759
Posts: 3095
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:26 pm

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby bd6759 » Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:51 am

Also, see page FN10 of the tax return guidance notes SA106 - Foreign Notes. These tell you how to fill in a tax return.

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/worksheets/sa106-notes.pdf

With respect, most Treaties contain similar wording, following the OECD statndard. If you are unable to understand the terms of a standard article, should you really be charging people for completing tax returns?

simpsonite
Posts: 96
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:58 am

Re: Uk Resident and receiving German pension

Postby simpsonite » Tue Oct 14, 2014 1:02 pm

With respect to you bd6759,
Article 17 of that particular double taxation treaty is in in my opinion not set out In a clear & concise manner.
Not sure about the OECD statndard but you possibly need to check your spelling.

With respect bd6759 I am greatful for your response to my query , not to mention your advice on how to complete a tax return & thoughts on my billing policy.

With respect bd6759, I feel you are missing the point as to why queries are raised on this tax web forum in the first instance.
You clearly have all the answers.lol
I pity your work colleagues( if you have any of course) :roll:


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