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Where Taxpayers and Advisers Meet

HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

redfloyd
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:57 pm

HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby redfloyd » Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:07 pm

I ran my own businesses up to 2006. I decided to close the business and take early retirement. My wife and i sold up and moved overseas. We decided to come back in 2012 for personnel reasons. I then decided to take a paye job.
During the paye jobs i overpaid tax and received tax rebates 2012/ to 2015. In 2016/17 i was offered a job working under the UTR paying tax at 20%. I employed an accountant to file my tax return for that year, i was told i was due a tax rebate of £2,700.

After waiting a few weeks i rang the hnrc to see what the delay was. They informed me the £2,700 would not be refunded in fact this amount would be kept to pay off underpayment in 2001/02-----2002/3 and 2003/4. I asked them for paperwork to support this claim. They sent me a basic statement letter showing dates and amounts. I wrote to them asking for the actual paperwork that enabled them to reach this decision, they replied saying the underpayments was discovered in 2007, and as a tax payer it was my responsibility to inform them of my new address. They said the paper work does no longer exist and state i have no grounds to appeal.

They also issued me with a new tax code of K648 X which gives me a tax free amount of
-£6490 Note this is minus £6490. As you can imagine as a tax payer all my life and now reached retirement age i have found all this extremely distressing. Any help or advice would be very much appreciated.

SteLacca
Posts: 447
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:17 pm

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby SteLacca » Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:51 am

Press for more details. If you were in self-assessment for 2000 - 2004, then the only way that they can amend the charge for those years would be an enquiry. In 2007 they would have been out of time to open an enquiry, and so would have had to rely on S.28 to raise discovery assessments, which would require deliberate action on your part in hiding income in the earlier years.

DSW TaxResolution
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:07 pm
Contact:

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby DSW TaxResolution » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:50 am

As the above post correctly states, they need either an opening enquiry or to prove 'discovery'. It sounds very strange that they have taken this long to reach their stated position.
Id communicate with them only in writing and ask them to evidence the authority for their assessments.
www.dswcapital.com
Tax Investigation Service

wamstax
Posts: 1869
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:39 pm
Location: Operate Nationally but based in Aberdeen
Contact:

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby wamstax » Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:19 am

On the principle of he who asserts must prove just to provide a statement of account (assumption from your post) tells you nothing.

Unless
(A)you failed to file returns for the relevant years or
(B) failed to pay taxes you had self assessed or
(C) failed to include all your income on the tax returns for the years ended 5th April 2002 or 2003 or
(D) HMRC had made a determination of unpaid duties in absence of returns

there is no way that there could be these “under payments” in the absence of an enquiry into these tax returns following a notice under S9 TMA 1970.

In 2007 they could have raised an assessment for 2003-04 under the normal S29 [Discovery provisions] if they discovered ( only after the time limit for enquiring into each tax return had elapsed) that income had been under assessed irrespective whether you were negligent. However for the earlier years HMRC would require to prove that you were at least negligent in each of these two years before being able to validate their assessments and if they can’t then they now need to prove matters.

While they say there are no grounds for appeal there is one as follows “ I did not receive any enquiry notice; closure notice - which would in any case be invalid as I did not receive an enquiry notice; or assessment - which would in any case be invalid as there has been no discovery that income was understated nor have you proved that I was negligent in the submission of my returns. Nor am I aware that I did not file the correct returns for these years or pay any taxes self assessed by me”
regards and hope this helps
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Operates Nationally with competitive costs
and email and phone contact can be obtained from website

bd6759
Posts: 3109
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:26 pm

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby bd6759 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:15 pm

There was a 6 year ordinary time limit back in 2007. No need for negligence.

wamstax
Posts: 1869
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:39 pm
Location: Operate Nationally but based in Aberdeen
Contact:

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby wamstax » Tue Mar 13, 2018 3:59 pm

Oops bd you are of course correct
regards and hope this helps
http://www.wamstaxltd.com
Operates Nationally with competitive costs
and email and phone contact can be obtained from website

SteLacca
Posts: 447
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:17 pm

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby SteLacca » Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:18 pm

But as it stands, there's no evidence that HMRC ever opened an enquiry in the first place.

wamstax
Posts: 1869
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:39 pm
Location: Operate Nationally but based in Aberdeen
Contact:

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby wamstax » Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:21 pm

Yes discovery requirements still the same and after statutory return submission date anniversary
regards and hope this helps
http://www.wamstaxltd.com
Operates Nationally with competitive costs
and email and phone contact can be obtained from website

bd6759
Posts: 3109
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:26 pm

Re: HMRC hold no documentation to support there claim

Postby bd6759 » Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:25 pm

We are all guessing. The OP needs to clarify.


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